"They never stole one, I am sure; they may have got one sometime." "Well, doctor, you know pretty well whether that story is true or not, that Tucker tells. What do you think of it?" "I don't think it is true. I would have heard more about it, that is true. I lived a mile from Smith's; am seventy-six years old. They were peaceable among themselves. The old woman had a great deal of faith that their children were going to do something great. Joe was quite illiterate. After they began to have school at their house, he improved greatly." "Did they have school in their own house?" "Yes, sir; they had school in their house, and studied the Bible." "Who was their teacher?" "They did not have any teacher; they taught themselves." * * * * * * * * "If young Smith was illiterate as you say, doctor, how do you account for the Book of Mormon?" "Well, I can't; except that Sidney Rigdon was connected with them." "What makes you think he was connected with them?" "Because I can't account for the Book of Mormon any other way." "Was Rigdon ever around there before the Book of Mormon was published?" "No; not as we could ever find out. Sidney Rigdon was never there, that Hurlburt, or Howe, or Tucker could find out." "Well; you have been looking out for the facts a long time have you not, doctor?" "Yes; I have been thinking and hearing about it for the last fifty years, and lived right among all their old neighbors there most of the time." "And no one has ever been able to trace the acquaintance of Rigdon and Smith, until after the Book of Mormon was published, and Rigdon proselyted by Pratt, in Ohio?" "Not that I know of." * * * * * * * "Were you acquainted with them" (the Smiths) "Mr. Saunders?" "Yes, sir, I knew all of the Smith family well; there were six boys: Alvin, Hyrum, Joseph, Harrison, William and Carlos, and there were two girls; the old man was a cooper; they have all worked for me many a day; they were very good people. Young Joe (as we called him then), has worked for me, and he was a good worker; they all were. I did not consider them good managers about business, but they were poor people; the old man had a large family." "In what respect did they differ from other people, if at all?" "I never noticed that they were different from other neighbors; they were the best family in the neighborhood in case of sickness; one was at my house nearly all the time when my father died; I always thought them honest; they were owing me some money when they left here; that is, the old man and Hyrum did, and Martin Harris. One of them came back in about a year and paid me." "How were they as to habits of drinking and getting drunk?"