"I met Generals von Plessen and Marschall, who told me that the Field Marshall (Hindenburg) and General Groener were on the way to tell the Kaiser that his immediate abdication was necessary. I answered: 'You're mad. The army is on the Kaiser's side.' The two took me with them to the Kaiser. The conference began by Hindenburg's saying to the Kaiser that he must beg to be permitted to resign, since he could not, as a Prussian officer, give his King the message which he must give. The Kaiser answered: 'Well, let us hear the message first.' Thereupon Groener gave a long description of the situation, the homeland in the hands of revolutionists, revolution to be expected in Berlin at any minute, and the army not to be depended on. To attempt with the enemy in the rear to turn the army about and set it in march for civil warfare was not to be thought of. The only salvation for the Fatherland lay in the Kaiser's immediate abdication. Hindenburg, the general intendant and chief of military railways agreed with Groener." [53] Cf. Scheidemann's statement to von Payer, chapter viii. The Kaiser asked von Schulenberg's opinion. He disagreed with the others, and counseled resistance. He agreed that it would be impossible to invade all Germany with united front, but advocated an attack on a few places, such as Cologne and Aachen, with picked troops, and an appeal to the people to rise against the marines, who had been "incited to action by the Jews, who had made great profits in the war, and by persons who had escaped doing their duty in the war and were now trying to knife the army in the back." The Kaiser approved this counsel. He would not abdicate, he declared, nor would he have any part in bringing about civil warfare, but Cologne, Aachen and Verviers must be attacked immediately. Groener was unconvinced. He declared that the revolution had gone too far and was too well organized throughout Germany to make it possible to put it down by force of arms. Moreover, he said, several army chiefs had reported that the army could no longer be depended on. The Kaiser thereupon asked for a report from every army chief on the army's dependability. A summons to this effect was sent out, and Groener, Hindenburg and von Schulenberg remained with the Kaiser. One calamitous report after another began coming from Berlin. The military governor reported that he had no longer any dependable troops. The Chancellor telephoned that civil war was inevitable unless the Kaiser's abdication was received within a few minutes. The Kaiser and the Crown Prince conferred together. Another report came from the Chancellor that the situation in Berlin was steadily becoming graver. Admiral von Hintze, Minister of Foreign Affairs, who had joined the little group in the Kaiser's rooms, declared that the monarchy could not be saved unless the Kaiser abdicated at once. Von Schulenberg continues: