Mr. OGILVIE. Eliminate the publisher. He has no concern with it. The Constitution does not grant him any rights under the copyright law. He is not the "inventor" or the "author." Eliminate the publisher wholly, unless you desire, in case there may be an investment there that the publisher desires to protect, to let the author take care of that by contract, so that at the expiration of the copyright the publisher may have the right to continue the publication on the payment of the same royalty. Mr. CURRIER. Can you suggest an amendment to carry out your idea in the matter? Mr. OGILVIE. Yes, sir. Unless the publisher shall agree to pay at least the same royalty for an extension of the copyright as has been paid during the previous years, the author shall have the sole right to apply for and secure an extension of copyright. Mr. CHANEY. You are really talking against your own interests as a publisher just now? Mr. OGILVIE. I am, absolutely, talking against my interests as a publisher. Mr. SULZER. Do you contend that this provision would apply where the publisher had no interest in the publication beyond the ordinary time of copyright? Mr. OGILVIE. That is all; it shall apply only to that case. Mr. SULZER. I construe this provision in here to be just what you say. Mr. OGILVIE. No; I read it differently from the way you do, and place a different construction upon it. We will again refer to it and see if I am wrong. If I am wrong, I shall be glad to be put right, and if you are wrong, I know that you will be glad to be put right. Mr. SULZER. It says here unless the assignee or licensee shall join in the application. If a man is an assignee or licensee he has an interest in the copyright. Mr. OGILVIE. He takes it for the time limit only. Mr. SULZER. If he is not he has no interest, and would not have to join with the widow or children in this application for an extension of the copyright. Mr. OGILVIE. But if he is the assignee or licensee then he is interested in it only during the life of the copyright. Mr. SULZER. I do not understand it that way. Mr. HINSHAW. How could the licensee have any interest in the copyright beyond the life of it? Mr. SULZER. He would have an interest in it so far as it could be extended. Mr. OGILVIE. Why should he? Mr. BONYNGE. He has not. There is no provision now for the extension, and he would not have, except as he might get it under this bill. Mr. CAMPBELL. He would provide for that in his contract. Mr. OGILVIE. Yes. Leave it out of the law. Mr. CAMPBELL. When the assignment was made, he would provide for all extensions. Mr. OGILVIE. That is right. Mr. HINSHAW. Are these contracts for royalty made to include a possible extension of the copyright? Mr. OGILVIE. Not generally; because the author may be dead when the time for the renewal comes. Mr. CURRIER. But it can be renewed then by his widow. Mr. OGILVIE. But they do not do it generally.