Mr. CURRIER. I should suppose that in almost all cases under the existing law they would get a renewal. Mr. OGILVIE. They do at times, but not often. Mr. SULZER. I think I understand what you mean, and that is this: That where there is no subsisting contract, then that the publisher shall not join---- Mr. OGILVIE. The publishers shall not be required to join. Mr. SULZER (continuing). In the application for the renewal of the copyright? Mr. OGILVIE. Yes. As this is, it makes it impossible for the author or his widow or children to secure the extension of the copyright without the licensee joining. Then he has it in his power to diminish the royalty paid to suit his own purpose. Mr. CAMPBELL. If the contract for the copyright does not provide as between the author and the publisher for any renewal, what position would you be in then? Mr. OGILVIE. According to this law it is impossible to get a renewal unless the licensee joins in the request. Mr. CAMPBELL. The license expires---- Mr. OGILVIE. But the license does not expire until after the copyright expires. Mr. CAMPBELL. What is the length of your contract that you usually make? Mr. OGILVIE. This is a new provision entirely. Mr. CAMPBELL. Under the old law, I mean? Mr. OGILVIE. Under the old law it usually lasts as long as the copyright lasts. Mr. CHANEY. You suggest that we leave out this last proviso absolutely? Mr. OGILVIE. Yes, sir. Mr. BONYNGE. Not to leave it out absolutely---- Mr. OGILVIE. I think it should be left out altogether. It is wholly unfair to an author. I can see no reason why the publisher should have any right of that kind. The Constitution grants the right to an author, and if the publisher desires to secure those rights that is a matter of contract. Let him make a contract covering that point. Mr. HINSHAW. If the copyright had been assigned, the original proprietor would have lost all interest in the copyright; would he not? Mr. OGILVIE. The party who now takes a copyright takes it with the understanding that it shall expire at a certain time; and then he is in no better position and no worse than any other publisher who has not had a contract with the author. Mr. CHANEY. Suppose your contracts under this bill, should it become a law, should provide for the life of the copyright, together with any extensions thereof--then what would you say as to the proviso? Mr. OGILVIE. Suppose the bill should provide for the life of the contract, together with any extension thereof? Mr. CHANEY. Suppose under this bill, should it become a law, your contracts with the author should provide for the license and assignment to extend the copyright during its life and all extensions thereof?