“That was a stupid saying; but that is the result of disputing with shoemakers. Besides, it is degrading to compare women to wine! He is a coarse fellow who sets his wife on the same level with a beer-barrel.” “Logic is not his strong point, and his comparisons halt on crutches. In his answer to the Pope’s excommunication, he writes, among other things: ‘If a hay-cart must move out of the way of a drunken man, how much more must Peter and Jesus Christ keep out of the way of the Pope?’” “That is a pretty simile! Let us return to James Bainham.” “But let me tell you a little more about the fanatics in Germany. Besides Karlstadt and his followers, other enthusiasts, quoting the Bible and Luther, have had themselves rebaptized; their leader has taken ten wives, supporting his action by the example of David, Solomon, and even Abraham.” “The Bible again!--Call in Bainham, and then we will hear how the matter stands! He was a lawyer in the Temple, you say, and has been spreading Luther’s teaching. Have we not had enough of Wycliffe and the Lollards? Must we have the same thing again, grunted out by this German plagiariser?” “I am not an intolerant man,” said More, “but a State must be homogeneous, or it will fall to pieces. Ignoramuses and lunatics must not come forward and sniff at the State religion, be it better or worse.” “Let Bainham come, and we will hear him.” More went to a door which was guarded on the outside by soldiers, and gave an order. “You examine him, and I will listen,” said the Cardinal. After a time Bainham was brought into the room in chains. More sat at the end of a table, and commenced. “James Bainham, can you declare your belief in a few words?” “I believe in God’s Word--_i.e._ the whole of Holy Scripture.” “Do you really--in the Old as well as the New Testament?” “In both.” “In the Old also?” “In both.” “Very well, then, you believe in the Old Testament. Now, you have had yourself baptized again, for the Bible says, ‘Go, and teach all nations and baptize them.’ Good. But have you had yourself circumcised, as the Bible commands?” Bainham looked confounded, and the Cardinal had to turn his head, in order not to smile. “I am not an Israelite,” answered Bainham. “No! but Nathanael, who sought our Saviour and believed on him, was called by John ‘an Israelite indeed.’ If you are not an ‘Israelite indeed,’ you are not a Christian.” “I cannot answer that.” “No, you cannot answer, but you can preach and talk rubbish. Are you a Lutheran?” “Yes.” “But Luther is against the Anabaptists; therefore he is against you, and he has asked the princes to kill the Anabaptists like wild dogs. Are you still a Lutheran?” “Yes, according to his early teaching.” “You mean justification by faith. What do you believe?” “I believe in God the Father....”