MR. WARD: The soil around Rochester is very heavy like what we call slashland type of soil here in Indiana, and where this occurs we find that the hickory nut does very, very poorly. I wouldn't advise putting them on such soils. The black walnut will grow a lot better in places like that. MR. GERARDI: In Illinois we have that deep, black soil and we just call it plain gumbo. It's all filled-in soil, and I never have reached the bottom. It's at least 20 feet thick. And these swamp hickories--I think Reed was the one that called them swamp hickories--thrive there. They can be two months under water six foot deep, and still bear wonderful crops. You can get a wagon load of them in that mucky soil. MR. CALDWELL: The hickory in New York State which will stand the most moist conditions is the bitternut hickory, and with that root stock you may be able to get some of the others through. The shagbark will withstand considerable moisture if it has deep soil. The bitternut does well on shallow soil or the soil that is made shallow by high water. MR. O'ROURKE: The bitternut, then, will survive wet conditions. This is of interest as far as root stocks are concerned. I am wondering if anyone would like to report on the ability of the pecan to take wet soil conditions. MR. WILKINSON: They will turn out all right if they have dry feet during the summer months, but they will not stand wet feet all summer. MR. O'ROURKE: Will the bitternut do better, or would the mockernut? MR. WILKINSON: I am not well enough versed on that to say. But the pecan, I have seen them stand under water for weeks at a time two or three times during the winter, water 20 feet deep and not affect them at all. But if they are around in a place where the water stands in July and August, they won't take it. MR. O'ROURKE: Any other discussion on stocks that will take wet soil conditions? If not, let us take up Mr. Beckert's question: When do you take scion wood of the shagbark hickory? Who would like to answer that? Mr. Gerardi? MR. GERARDI: The time I like best, the time it can be done in our particular area is the latter part of February. Leave it on the tree as long as you can before any sap rises. MR. O'ROURKE: You would say probably 10 days to 2 weeks before the bud scales would break? MR. GERARDI: That's right, before any growth begins. MR. O'ROURKE: Any other comment on that? Dr. McKay? DR. MCKAY: I want to ask the question about which there is difference of opinion. Do pecan seed have a rest period, and is there any difference between pecans and hickory in that respect?