The Royal Commission on Civil Establishments, 1888, took up at some length, the question of the pressure brought by the civil servants upon the House of Commons for increases of wages and salaries. Before that Commission, Sir Reginald E. Welby, who had entered the Treasury in 1856, had become Assistant Financial Secretary in 1880, and had been made Permanent Secretary to the Treasury in 1885, testified that many Members of the House of Commons had recently attended meetings of the civil servants for the purpose of endorsing the claims of the civil servants for increases of pay; and that they had taken that action without having made a close examination of the grounds upon which the civil servants had put forward their claims. He added: "It is utterly impossible for us [the Treasury] to ignore these symptoms that make it very difficult to keep within reasonable bounds the remuneration of such a body." Thereupon one of the members of the Royal Commission said to Sir R. Welby: ... "but are you not aware that there is a general feeling throughout the country among the people who are employed by private individuals and public bodies [other than the State], that Government servants receive higher pay than they do, and that when these persons are called upon to exercise the franchise they bring pressure to bear upon their Members just the other way [_i. e._, against the increase of government wages and salaries]?" Sir R. Welby replied: "Of course, I have no means of testing that. I am very glad to hear that Parliamentary influence is not all in one direction. We do not see the proof of it at the Treasury."[140] Sir Algernon E. West, Chairman Inland Revenue Commissioners,[141] said he wished for a greater spirit of economy, "not in the offices so much as outside." Thereupon the Chairman of the Royal Commission said: "I do not quite understand what you mean by outside." Sir Algernon E. West replied: "I say it with all possible deference, particularly Parliament." To the further query: "Has there been on the part of Members of Parliament, an increase of intervention on behalf either of the individual officers of the Inland Revenue or on behalf of classes of the Inland Revenue since the enfranchisement in 1869?" Sir A. West replied: "A large increase on behalf of classes, not of individuals.... I should like to add ... that I think last year the Lower Division clerks succeeded in getting two hundred Members of Parliament to attend a meeting which was held to protest against their grievances."[142]