_Wesley._ Yea, the reality of religion. Let us appeal to any commonplace book for evidences of grace, and they are found in and upon these converts. _Bishop._ How many are there of them? _Wesley._ I number not the people. _Bishop._ Where are they? _Wesley._ Wherever I have been called to preach—at Radipole, Melcombe, Turnworth, Whitchurch, and at sea. I shall add another ingredient of my mission. 5. When the church saw the presence of God going along with me, they did, by fasting and prayer, in a day set apart for that end, seek an abundant blessing on my endeavours. _Bishop._ A particular church? _Wesley._ Yes, my lord. I am not ashamed to own myself a member of one. _Bishop._ Why, you mistake the apostles’ intent. They went about to convert heathens, and so did what they did. You have no warrant for your particular churches. _Wesley._ We have a plain, full, and sufficient rule for gospel worship in the New Testament, recorded in the Acts of the Apostles and in the Epistles. _Bishop._ We have not. _Wesley._ The practice of the apostles is a standing rule in those cases which were not extraordinary. _Bishop._ Not their practice, but their precepts. _Wesley._ Both precepts and practice. Our duty is not delivered to us in Scripture only by precepts, but by precedents, by promises, and by threatenings mixed. We are to follow them as they followed Christ. _Bishop._ But the apostle said, “This speak I; not the Lord”—that is, by revelation. _Wesley._ Some interpret that place, “This speak I now, by revelation from the Lord”—not the Lord in that text before instanced, when he gave answer concerning divorce. May it please your lordship, we believe that “cultus non institutus est indebitus.” _Bishop._ It is false. _Wesley._ The second commandment speaks the same: “Thou shalt not make unto thyself any graven image.” _Bishop._ That is, forms of your own invention. _Wesley._ Bishop Andrews, taking notice of “non facies tibi,” satisfied me that we may not worship God but as commanded. _Bishop._ You take discipline, church government, and circumstances for worship. _Wesley._ You account ceremonies a part of worship. _Bishop._ But what say you? Did you not wear a sword in the time of the Committee of Safety, with Demy and the rest of them? _Wesley._ My lord, I have given you my answer therein; and I further say, that I have conscientiously taken the oath of allegiance, and faithfully kept it hitherto. I appeal to all that are around me. _Bishop._ But nobody will trust you. You stood it out to the last gasp. _Wesley._ I know not what you mean by the last gasp. When I saw the pleasure of Providence to turn the order of things, I did submit quietly thereto. _Bishop._ That was at last. _Wesley._ Yet many such men are trusted, and now about the king. _Bishop._ They are such as, though on the parliament side during the war, yet disown those latter proceedings; but you abode even till Haselrig’s coming to Portsmouth.