When he had concluded I rose and said, "You have told us much about Wagner, but nothing about his music. I trust I am not unparliamentary when I say that if he is to be judged by the effect of his works on the public--works that have now been for years before the world--Wagner is an operatic failure, and that what the Rev. Mr. Haweis has told us about his operas is sheer nonsense. One question he puts to me is: 'Did I ever lose money by Wagner?' I say emphatically, 'yes.' I once brought over all the material for his trilogy, the _Ring des Nibelungen_, from Munich to London, where it was to have been produced (according to one of the conditions of the agreement) under the supervision of Wagner himself. The master did not come; but his work was produced under a conductor of his own choice, and when the series had been twice given about six thousand pounds had been lost. "My time will come yet. I labour under many difficulties now; but when New Yorkers are tired of backing German and American Opera, and will only subsidize me with one per cent. of the millions they are going to lose, I will return and give them Italian Opera." I remember an interesting and, I must admit, not altogether inexact account of my production of the _Ring des Nibelungen_ being given in the _Musical Journal_ of New York. "The series," wrote the American journalist, "was given under the special patronage of the Prince of Wales, who loyally remained in his box from the rising to the going down of the curtain, although he confessed afterwards that it was the toughest work he had ever done in his life. When Wotan came on the darkened stage and commenced his little recitative to an accompaniment of discords the Prince took a doze, but was awakened half-an-hour later by a double forte crash of the orchestra, and, having fallen asleep again, was startled by another climax fifteen minutes afterwards, when he found Wotan still at it, singing against time. At the end of five weeks Mapleson's share of the losses was 30,000 dollars; and the Prince told him confidentially that if Wotan appeared in any more operas he should withdraw his patronage." By dint of perseverance, together with the aid of various managers, I succeeded in producing Wallace's _Maritana_. I first performed it over in Brooklyn, where it met with the most unqualified success, nearly every piece of music being encored, while Ravelli roused the audience to frantic enthusiasm by a finely-delivered high C from the chest at the conclusion of "Let me like a soldier fall." On a third encore he sang it in English. I then returned to the New York Academy with this opera, thus fulfilling the second of my promises in the prospectus.