“Bodies are extended, that is they occupy a _room_, and the proportion which one body bears to the other in point of _room_, constitutes its _place_; spirits are not extended, and consequently exist in no _room_, and in no _place_.” “How am I to understand this?” “Just as I have said.--But let me elucidate my argument. Why cannot two bodies exist at the same time, in the same space? Because they exclude each other on account of their extension and impenetrability. Two bodies must, of course, occupy two different places, if existing at the same time; that is, every individual body must occupy its own individual place. And why must every body occupy its _own_ place?” “Because of its expansion and impenetrability.” “Very well! But these two qualities cannot appertain to a spirit, and, consequently, a spirit can occupy no place.” “This seems really to follow.” “This argument can also be stated thus: a spirit has, as a simple being, neither a right nor left, neither a front nor a back side, and consequently can have no relation from _no side_ to any thing that occupies a space. The conclusion is very palpable.” “Then a spirit could occupy no room in the whole material world?” “Would you perhaps assign to spirits a place in the immaterial world? How could you imagine, without contradiction, that space or place can exist in _such_ a world? If one spirit does not occupy a room, then all spirits together can occupy none, how could therefore any proportion exist among them with relation to space or place?” “I comprehend and do not comprehend you. You want to convince me of the possibility of apparitions of spirits, and deny the existence of spirits; for if they do occupy no place either in the visible or invisible world, _where_ else can they exist?” “How sensitive and confused your ideas are! Don’t you perceive that your question is equal to this: _in which place_ do spirits exist? and that, of course, you premise in your question what I have just clearly proved to be absurd. Do you not comprehend that _room_ and _place_ are nothing else but _external_ qualities, only relations of _material_ things? and do you believe that the existence of any being depends merely on external qualities and material relations?” “Have patience with me!” “I have; for I am well aware how difficult it is to abstract from material ideas; however, since they cannot be applicable to spirits we must renounce them, else we cannot pass over the bounds of the material world.” “I intreat you, Hiermanfor, to go on!”