Well, I think they had it out at that time. I don't know about that, but anyway, I think that was about the only time that Eddie saw John, was during the time that he had this ear trouble, when he was an infant. She wouldn't let John see Eddie. For myself, I thought that was cruel, because I don't believe in that. Mr. JENNER. Now I am interested in that, Mrs. Murret. You say she refused to permit her former husband to see the child? Mrs. MURRET. Well, now I don't know whether he even asked to see the child or not. I don't know. Mr. JENNER. Well, you did say without prompting from me that she wouldn't permit him to see the child, didn't you? Mrs. MURRET. That's right, she wouldn't. Mr. JENNER. I draw the inference from that to mean that he might have desired to see the child, but she wouldn't permit him, but you don't know that? Mrs. MURRET. No; I don't know if he asked to see the child or not. Mr. JENNER. But you do have a recollection that she would not let Eddie see the child; is that right? Mrs. MURRET. That's right. John never saw him after that, I don't think, not after he was a child. Mr. JENNER. But you said she was opposed to him seeing the child; is that right? Mrs. MURRET. Oh, yes; I imagine she was. Mr. JENNER. Did anything else occur in this marriage up to the time of Marguerite's marriage to Oswald, anything else that you would say was unusual insofar as personality is concerned? Mrs. MURRET. No; not that I can think of. Mr. JENNER. You have mentioned a couple of aspects already. Mrs. MURRET. No; I don't know of anything else. That would be about all I know. When she became pregnant and they separated, you know, it was just probably a day after that, whatever it was, but then she sued for a divorce and went to live in Carrollton, and the divorce was granted, and she got the child, and he supported John for 18 years. He sent him a good amount. He never failed to make one payment, and of course she got alimony for herself. Of course, living the way we did as children, we knew how to economize and live on a small amount of money, where people who have always had a lot wouldn't know how to do that. Mr. JENNER. Of course I gather from what you have said--as a matter of fact, you said it, but had you said otherwise I would have been surprised, that your father was rearing six children, and he was a motorman on the streetcar lines here; is that right? Mrs. MURRET. Yes. Mr. JENNER. And you were necessarily poor people. Mrs. MURRET. Yes; he made $90 a month. We paid $12 a month house rent, or $14 a month house rent--I forget which--and every day he would give us each $1 to do the marketing with, and we would have something left out of the $1, believe it or not.