Mr. THORNLEY. Let me put it this way. I think you could sit down and argue with him for a number of years in a great marathon argument and have piles of facts and I don't think you could have changed his mind on that unless you knew why he believed it in the first place. I certainly don't. I don't think with any kind of formal argument you could have shaken that conviction. And that is why I say irrevocable. It was just--never getting back to looking at things from any other way once he had become a Marxist, whenever that was. Mr. JENNER. Was he able to articulate distinctions between Marxism, communism, capitalism, democracy? Mr. THORNLEY. At the time I knew him and argued with him he didn't bother to articulate distinctions between Marxism and communism. At a latter time I understand he did. Mr. JENNER. He attempted to. Mr. THORNLEY. At the time I knew his communism was the modern, living vicar of Marxism, period. Mr. JENNER. Were you in New Orleans when he was arrested for distributing Fair Play for Cuba Committee leaflets? Mr. THORNLEY. I arrived in New Orleans in the early part of September. If I was in New Orleans---- Mr. JENNER. 1963? Mr. THORNLEY. Yes. Mr. JENNER. This occurred in August of 1963. Mr. THORNLEY. Then I wasn't there; no. Mr. JENNER. Did you hear about it? Mr. THORNLEY. No; I didn't. I didn't hear about it until after the assassination. Mr. JENNER. Did you ever hear any of those tapes? Mr. THORNLEY. I heard part of one of them after the assassination, once again. Mr. JENNER. Did that part include his effort to distinguish between Marxism and democracy in response to a question put to him by either Mr. Stuckey or one of the other participants? Mr. THORNLEY. That is exactly what he was talking about at the time. I happened to be standing in the television station in New Orleans and he was saying, and I just got a snatch of it, I was passing through the room or something; and he was saying, "Well, there are many Marxist countries in the world today." Mr. JENNER. This was by way of his answering a question as to what was the distinction between Marxism and communism? Mr. THORNLEY. Yes; he was saying there are many non-Communist Marxist countries in the world today and he was definitely making a distinction between Marxism and communism. Mr. JENNER. But all he did was to cite the countries. He didn't attempt to make the distinction. Mr. THORNLEY. It was only a snatch of it. Mr. JENNER. That was a fair representation of his utterances during those two radio broadcasts and one television broadcast. You mentioned also that you had a feeling on his part that he was laboring under a persecution complex? Mr. THORNLEY. Yes. Mr. JENNER. That was not necessarily based alone on the incident you relate that occurred on that Saturday morning? Were there other incidents?