Mr. HUBERT. Because of the change of plans which required the bringing up of automobiles to get into the ramp leading up Commerce Street, it is your thought it was necessary to alter that, and that someone did alter them to allow some of the press to be on the ramp leading toward Main Street? Chief STEVENSON. Yes, sir; I believe that is right. Mr. HUBERT. In fact, how many were there, do you recall? Chief STEVENSON. No; I don’t. I would say there were possibly, when I went down the last time immediately before the transfer, I would say there was possibly 20 to 30 back up the ramp. Mr. HUBERT. Were any police officers in front of them? Chief STEVENSON. Oh, yes. Mr. HUBERT. Now were you present during the conversation between Chief Curry and Sheriff Decker regarding the matter of who would transfer the prisoner? Chief STEVENSON. No, sir; I don’t believe I was in the chief’s office at the time he called Sheriff Decker, Mr. Hubert. Mr. HUBERT. About when did you learn that the police department would actually accomplish the transfer itself? Chief STEVENSON. It was shortly after he had talked to him. When he advised Chief Batchelor and I that he had called him, I believe Chief Batchelor was with me. He had called the sheriff, and the sheriff had told him that he understood we were to transfer the prisoner, and he told him if that was his wish, we would. As to what time in the morning that was, I would say that was somewhere around 9 o’clock, Mr. Hubert, the best I recollect. Mr. HUBERT. What makes you fix it at 9 o’clock? Chief STEVENSON. Because I know between 9 and 10 after that conversation had taken place, Chief Curry and Chief Batchelor and I was in on a part of the discussion of using an armored truck. And Chief Curry instructed Chief Batchelor to see if he could contact an armored truck company who could furnish us one. That was between 9 and 10 when that was done. Mr. HUBERT. Your thought is that the conversation between Curry and Batchelor was before that, of course? Chief STEVENSON. Between Curry and Batchelor? Mr. HUBERT. And Decker, was before that? Chief STEVENSON. Yes; that was when he found out that we would make the transfer, or when he had advised Chief Batchelor and I that we would. Mr. HUBERT. Now there was a change of plans from that, and I would like you to state, if you would, what you know about the change of plans, when it occurred, and so forth. That is to say, the decision not to use the armored car. Chief STEVENSON. I would say that was made, the first of my knowledge, Mr. Hubert, at approximately 11:10. I went up into the homicide bureau on the third floor. Chief Curry and Lieutenant Pierce were in the homicide bureau. Oswald was there in Captain Fritz’ office. They had been interrogating him. I went into the office. Chief Curry advised me they had decided to use an automobile for the transfer and use the truck as a decoy. The automobile was more maneuverable.