RICHARD GOUGH, examined by Mr. Mitchell, stated: I am a shipwright surveyor, and have been working for about three years surveying ships for the Marine Board. I knew the _Alert_, and on two occasions made a survey of her for the river and Bay trade. The last survey I made was in April, 1893. I then made a declaration. I should say the _Alert_ was sea-worthy in every respect. The opening spoken of as the pantry window was about fourteen inches by twelve inches square. The glass was about half-an-inch thick, and was in a strong wooden frame. I don’t remember how it was fastened. It would not make the ship unsea-worthy in the slightest degree. The grating was a great height from the main deck, and if any water went down it would only be a splash. The bunker lids fitted into sockets. They rested by their own weight. Unless the ship were upside down no water could go through them. In my opinion the wooden awning did not make the ship unsea-worthy. When the alterations were being made I did not have before me the specification of what had to be done. Cross-examined by Mr. Box: On one occasion after repairs were completed the _Alert_ had a permit to go to Tasmania, not a certificate. A certificate is for a year; a permit is only for the occasion. I gave a certificate to the engineer. There would be no examination of the vessel again on her return from Tasmania because she had a certificate for the river and Bay trade. We do not make a declaration to give a permit. I did not make a declaration that the _Alert_ was fit for the outside trade. Captain Deary was appointed shipwright surveyor, and he took my place. Captain Deary is not a shipwright, but I cannot help that. He was appointed, and is a shipwright surveyor by virtue of his office. A shipwright surveyor’s certificate should be given by a man skilled in shipwright surveying. I never measured the grating. When I surveyed the _Alert_ for the permit to go outside the Heads to Tasmania, she had not got a shutter in front of the window. I do not remember whether she had a shutter at any time I surveyed her. I signed a certificate about life-boats only for the river and Bay trade. I signed only the permit to go outside. The _Alert_ was built for shallow water. Re-examined by Mr. Mitchell: In my opinion the _Alert_ was a sea-worthy vessel fit to go to Tasmania. When Captain Deary made the declaration that she was fit for the outside trade, I was still a shipwright surveyor, but was receiving no pay from the Marine Board. I had ceased to be their officer through retrenchment. I believe the _Alert’s_ trip to Tasmania had something to do with clearing the Customs duty off her engines.