At two o'clock they reassembled for the afternoon conference; and now they got even closer to the heart of the matter, for the subject was to be, whether the Church could err? Fulke asserted that it could, and did; and made a syllogism: "Whatsoever error is incident to every member, is incident to the whole. But it is incident to every member to err; _ergo_, to the whole." "I deny both _major_ and _minor_," said Campion quietly. "Every man may err, but not the whole gathered together; for the whole hath a promise, but so hath not every particular man." Fulke denied this stoutly, and beat on the table. "Every member hath the spirit of Christ," he said, "which is the spirit of truth; and therefore hath the same promise that the whole hath." "Why, then," said Campion, smiling, "there should be no heretics." "Yes," answered Fulke, "heretics may be within the Church, but not of the Church." And so they found themselves back again where they started from. Anthony sat back on the oak bench and sighed, and glanced round at the interested faces of the theologians and the yawns of the amateurs, as the debate rolled on over the old ground, and touched on free will, and grace, and infant baptism; until the Lieutenant interposed: "Master Doctors," he said, with a judicial air, "the question that was appointed before dinner was, whether the visible Church may err"--to which Goode retorted that the digressions were all Campion's fault. Then the debate took the form of contradictions. "Whatsoever congregation doth err in matters of faith," said Goode, "is not the true Church; but the Church of Rome erreth in matters of faith; _ergo_, it is not the true Church." "I deny your _minor_," said Campion, "the Church of Rome hath not erred." Then the same process was repeated over the Council of Trent; and the debate whirled off once more into details and irrelevancies about imputed righteousness, and the denial of the Cup to the laity. Again the audience grew restless. They had not come there, most of them, to listen to theological minutiæ, but to see sport; and this interminable chopping of words that resulted in nothing bored them profoundly. A murmur of conversation began to buzz on all sides. Campion was in despair. "Thus shall we run into all questions," he cried hopelessly, "and then we shall have done this time twelve months." But Fulke would not let him be; but pressed on a question about the Council of Nice. "Now we shall have the matter of images," sighed Campion. "You are _nimis acutus_," retorted Fulke, "you will leap over the stile or ever you come to it. I mean not to speak of images." And so with a few more irrelevancies the debate ended. The third debate in September (on the twenty-third), at which Anthony was again present, was on the subject of the Real Presence in the Blessed Sacrament. Fulke was in an evil temper, since it was common talk that Campion had had the best of the argument on the eighteenth.