We must now put into the box witnesses of a very important character whose testimony, so far as the aims of the Bond are concerned, is perfectly unexceptionable. These witnesses are Mr. Burgers, President of the South African Republic, Sir John Brand, President of the Orange Free State, Mr. Reitz, State Secretary of the South African Republic and previously President of the Orange Free State, and Mr. Steyn, Attorney-General and subsequently President of the Orange Free State. In 1875 President Burgers stated at a meeting held in Holland to consider the Delagoa Bay railway scheme, that he hoped to see a New Holland eight millions strong in South Africa, whence England shall have been expelled. It was President Brand who said, "Bartle Frere dreams of United South Africa under the British flag; and so do I, but not under the same flag." And when conducting a controversy with Kruger on the subject of a Customs Union, Sir John Brand, disgusted with treachery, cried aloud, "The Bond seeks to raise a Republican flag in a country with which we are at peace."[4] Mr. Theo. Schreiner, whose honesty and truthfulness no man in South Africa will deny, furnishes us with a circumstantial account of an interview between himself and Mr. Reitz in the early eighties.[5] Then Mr. Reitz was a judge at Bloemfontein, and was one of that band of Africander patriots whose aspiration and conduct remind us naturally of the aims, objects, and aspirations of the Young Ireland party under Smith O'Brien. After in vain trying to enlist Mr. Schreiner as a recruit, Mr. Reitz asked him to state the reason of his refusal. The reply was, "Because the ultimate object aimed at was the overthrow of British power and the expulsion of the British flag from South Africa." "Well, what if it is so?" was the rejoinder, to which Mr. Schreiner replied, "You don't suppose, do you, that the flag is going to disappear without a tremendous struggle and fight?" "Well," said Mr. Reitz, "I suppose not, but what of that?" Mr. Steyn, of the Orange Free State, made the following statement to the Rev. W. Tees, Presbyterian Minister in Durban:-- "Great Britain has been completely taken by surprise." "Sir, this has been preparing since the year 1884."[6] "In both States?" asked the clergyman. "Yes," was the reply, "in both, and in the Colony also. The Transvaal has been the arsenal, but those in the know in the Free State and in the Colony have worked in unison with Kruger. The object was to oust the British from South Africa, but it was not intended to do it all at once. The first step was the consolidation of the two Republics as a Sovereign International State, and later on an Africander rising at the right moment." Mr. Tees then asked a very pertinent question. "Then do you mean to say that when President Kruger attended the Bloemfontein Conference he knew perfectly well that the proceedings were a farce, and that he really meant to fight?" Mr. Steyn's reply was "Yes."