The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which Framed the Constitution of the United States, May-September 1787. Volume 2Madison, James
History
The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which Framed the Constitution of the United States, May-September 1787. Volume 2
Madison, James
Constitutional law -- United States; Constitutions -- United States; United States. Constitution
M^r Randolph called for division of the Section, so as to leave a
distinct question on the last words "each member shall have one vote."
He wished this last sentence to be postponed until the reconsideration
should have taken place on Sect. 5. Art. IV. concerning money bills. If
that section should not be reinstated his plan would be to vary the
representation in the Senate.
M^r Strong concurred in M^r Randolph's ideas on this point.
M^r Read did not consider the section as to money bills of any advantage
to the larger States and had voted for striking it out as being viewed
in the same light by the larger States. If it was considered by them as
of any value, and as a condition of the equality of votes in the Senate,
he had no objection to its being re-instated.
M^r Wilson--M^r Elseworth & M^r Madison urged that it was of no
advantage to the larger States, and that it might be a dangerous source
of contention between the two Houses. All the principal powers of the
Nat^l Legislature had some relation to money.
Doc^r Franklin, considered the two clauses, the originating of money
bills, and the equality of votes in the Senate, as essentially connected
by the compromise which had been agreed to.
Col. Mason said this was not the time for discussing this point. When
the originating of money bills shall be reconsidered, he thought it
could be demonstrated that it was of essential importance to restrain
the right to the House of Representatives the immediate choice of the
people.
M^r Williamson. The State of N. C. had agreed to an equality in the
Senate, merely in consideration that money bills should be confined to
the other House: and he was surprised to see the smaller States
forsaking the condition on which they had received their equality.
Question on the section 1. down to the last sentence
N. H. ay. Mass. no. C^t ay. N. J. ay. P^a[19] no. Del. ay.
M^d ay. Virg^a ay. N. C. no. S. C. div^d. Geo. ay.
[19] "In the printed Journal Pennsylvania ay."--Madison's
Note.
M^r Randolph moved that the last sentence "each member shall have one
vote," be postponed.
It was observed that this could not be necessary; as in case the
sanction as to originating money bills should not be reinstated, and a
revision of the Constitution should ensue, it w^d still be proper that
the members should vote per Capita. A postponement of the preceding
sentence allowing to each State 2 members w^d have been more proper.
M^r Mason, did not mean to propose a change of this mode of voting per
capita in any event. But as there might be other modes proposed, he saw
no impropriety in postponing the sentence. Each State may have two
members, and yet may have unequal votes. He said that unless the
exclusive originating of money bills should be restored to the House of
Representatives, he should, not from obstinacy but duty and conscience,
oppose throughout the equality of Representation in the Senate.
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