He paused a moment, like a true rhetorician, gratified at an opposition he deemed worthy to be controverted. ‘The objection, madam,’ he answered, ‘is a fair one; yet thus do I demolish it. True religion, it cannot be disputed, cometh from God, and not from the king, else why are we enjoined but to honour the latter, whilst we are to fear, and consequently obey, the former? This is the argument positive. Of the negative, I can produce instances in abundance. The following may be thought sufficient:--The Hebrews were not to conform to the idolatry of Pharaoh or the self-glorification of Nebuchadnezzar the King, nor were the primitive Christians to practise the degrading superstitions of the Roman Emperors.’ ‘Good,’ replied Mary; ‘yet we read not that Jew or Christian was justified in resisting with the sword.’ ‘The Almighty had not seen fit to give them the power,’ answered Knox. ‘Then you hold that subjects are entitled to take up arms against their sovereign,’ proceeded Mary. ‘In good faith, Master Knox, this is a dangerous doctrine even in these lawless times.’ ‘Extreme means are allowable in extreme cases,’ was his reply; ‘the father hath authority over his family, but if the father be seized with madness, it is lawful for the children to rise up against him, and, stripping him of his power, to place him under constraint, for his safety and their own. So is it with princes, madam; and that prince who goeth about in his frenzy to commit iniquity, must be disarmed, deposed, and cast into prison until he hath been brought to a more sober mind, and disciplined to submission under the will of Heaven.’ It was a bold argument to propound in a royal palace in the presence of majesty itself. The Queen looked at her brother, astonished and aghast. True to his part, Moray assumed an air of profound reflection and conviction after mature thought. Again Mary felt goaded to irritation as she wondered how Elizabeth would have brooked a similar discussion, but she commanded herself with a strong effort, and shifted her ground for a new attack. ‘And where shall we find this will of Heaven declared,’ argued the Queen, ‘or who shall decide between you and me when each interprets differently the same command?’ ‘The words of Scripture and the ordinances of the Church are sufficient for our guidance,’ replied the preacher. ‘But _your_ Church is not _mine_’, retorted the Queen. ‘I believe in my heart the Church of Rome to be the true Church of God.’