Q. Doctor, these persons were obliged to perform public service. If these conscientious objectors had not been there or if they had been used for public service, then you would not have had any experimental subjects. There must be a specific reason why you specifically used conscientious objectors and I ask you, please, to tell me that reason. A. Well, we could not have done the experiments unless the conscientious objectors had been available. That is the answer to your question. Q. Could you not have used prisoners, even conscientious objectors who refused to do public service and were therefore in prison without doing any work? Could you not have used them? A. Well, that would have meant that I and my assistants would have to go to the prison which was quite a distance away. The conscientious objectors could come to us at the university where they could live in the university dormitory or in the university hospital. Q. Doctor, if your experiments were really important—perhaps important in view of the state of war—then it is difficult to understand why the experiments could not have been carried out in a prison, let us say. Other experiments have been carried out in prisons to a large extent, and on another occasion. Doctor, you told us that you simply had to get in touch with the prisoners; you simply wrote them a letter or you put up a notice on the bulletin board and then, to a certain extent, you had prisoners available. Can you give me no other information as to why you used specifically and only conscientious objectors? A. No. If it had been convenient and necessary for me to use prisoners, I believe that we could have had prisoner volunteers for this work. Q. Witness, were you ever in a penitentiary as a visitor? A. Yes. Q. Did you see there how the criminals condemned to death were housed? A. Yes. Q. Are they completely at liberty there or are the criminals condemned to death locked up in their cells? A. They were locked up in their cells. Q. Now, can you please tell us how a criminal condemned to death is to see the notice that you would put on the bulletin board? You told us today that it was very simple—you simply put a notice on the bulletin board—and for hours now I have been trying to figure out how a criminal condemned to death, who is locked up in his cell, is going to see that notice on the bulletin board. A. While these prisoners are taken out for their meals, they can pass by a bulletin board, or a piece of paper with the statement on it which I read can be placed in their cells for reading or, as a large group in the dining room, the statement can be read to them. Q. Are criminals condemned to death together at meals in America? So far as I know, there too the criminal condemned to death is given his food through an opening in the cell door; he cannot eat in a common mess hall.