Mr. SPECTER. Could you see their faces reasonably clearly to observe that they were looking up. Mr. JACKSON. I could tell they were looking up because they were leaning way out just like that. I couldn't see their faces very well at all. Mr. SPECTER. The witness has leaned forward and turned his head to the right and looking upward as he sits in the witness chair, may the record show. Representative FORD. Did they both turn the same way as you have indicated in answer to Mr. Specter's question? Mr. JACKSON. To the best of my recollection one man looked up to his right and the other man looked up like this to his left, one in each window. Representative FORD. Can you identify which to his right and which to his left? Mr. JACKSON. I believe the one on the right window, my right, was looking to his right. The one on the west window, the one to my left was looking to his left. I believe I am right on that but I may not be because I just looked at them for a fraction of a second, I just followed them up. Mr. SPECTER. What is your best estimate of the distance which separated you from those two men at the time you observed them? Mr. JACKSON. I am not very good at distances. I was about the middle of the block, I guess. I would say around a hundred yards, I guess. Mr. SPECTER. Did you see those two men before or after you observed the rifle? Mr. JACKSON. Before. Mr. SPECTER. What is your best estimate of how many inches of the rifle that you observed? Mr. JACKSON. I saw the barrel and about half--well, I did not see a telescopic sight, but I did see part of the stock, so I guess maybe 8 or 10 inches of the stock maybe. I did see part of the stock, I did not see the sight. Mr. SPECTER. Eight or ten inches of the stock, and how much of the barrel would you estimate? Mr. JACKSON. I guess possibly a foot. Mr. SPECTER. Did you see anyone's hands on the rifle? Mr. JACKSON. No, sir. Mr. SPECTER. Now, as best as you can recollect it, what exact words did you state at or about the time you made the observation of the rifle, if any? Mr. JACKSON. I said, "There is the gun" and somebody said "Where?" And I said, "It came from that window" and I pointed to that window. Mr. SPECTER. Do you recollect who it was who said "Where?" Mr. JACKSON. Somebody in the car, I don't recall who. Mr. SPECTER. Did anybody else in the car say anything else at that time? Mr. JACKSON. Nothing that I could remember. I am sure they were all talking. Mr. SPECTER. Did you say anything else at about that time? Mr. JACKSON. If I did, I don't remember. Mr. SPECTER. Did anyone in the automobile state that he, too, had seen the rifle from the window? Mr. JACKSON. No, sir. Mr. SPECTER. Did you have a conversation with all of the men in the car immediately after the incident?