Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Well, there was a strained relationship there. You could feel that. And, you know how it is--you can see that the couple--that they are not very happy. You could feel that. And he was not particularly nice with her. He didn't kiss her. It wasn't a loving husband who would come home and smile and kiss his wife, and so on and so forth. He was just indifferent with her. He was more interested in talking to me than to her. That type of attitude. Mr. JENNER. But you did notice throughout all your acquaintance with him that he blossomed when you paid attention to him, let us say? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Exactly. Mr. JENNER. You drew him into conversation or situations--especially when you asked something about him? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes; exactly. I think that is his main characteristic. He wanted people to be interested in him, not in Marina. And she remained quite often in the background. Later on, even in conversation she would remain in the background, and he would do the talking. Mr. JENNER. Did he have an arrogant attitude? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. No; with me he has never been arrogant. Even when we came to the incident, you know, when we took the baby away from him, and Marina away from him later--you know that? Mr. JENNER. I want to get that in sequence. But you did it yourself, did you? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. My wife and I; yes. Mr. JENNER. Now, why do you not just go along and tell me as things develop. And how attitudes changed, and everything. Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Well, then we started getting reports, you know, from George Bouhe and the Clarks about them. We didn't see them very often. Mr. JENNER. Please, I don't want you to say you didn't see them very often. Maybe you didn't. Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. Mr. JENNER. I want to know how this developed. Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Well---- Mr. JENNER. When next did you see them, after this initial event? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. That I don't remember. I don't remember. But I do know that we saw Marina very soon afterward, because either my wife went to get her or my daughter went to get her--I don't remember that any more--to take her to the hospital. Or maybe George Bouhe brought her to our house so that my wife, who was free at the time, could take her to the dental clinic. I think that was the next time that we saw Marina. Maybe a few days later. Mr. JENNER. In any event, it was before Marina went to live with the Mellers? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes. Mr. JENNER. And it was before Marina went to live with the Taylors? Mr. DE MOHRENSCHILDT. Yes.