Mr. HUBERT. He was in front of the people that I have marked here in "area B," and "area A"? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir. Mr. HUBERT. Well, other than the detective, how many people do you suppose were in that "area A," right back of the curving line marked "1" to "2"? Mr. COMBEST. It would be an estimate on it at this time. I don't recall. There were several. I would say 15, at least. Mr. HUBERT. Do you think they were standing shoulder to shoulder? Mr. COMBEST. Yes; it was pretty crowded all the way around. Mr. HUBERT. That would make about what, two or three ranks of people? Mr. COMBEST. I don't recall exactly. I know there was a very large crowd in the basement that day. Mr. HUBERT. You are talking about the whole basement? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir. Mr. HUBERT. Were there any people in the area which I am marking roughly by an oblong figure, "area C," which is the ramp leading from the parking area into Main Street, Commerce Street ramp? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir; there were. Mr. HUBERT. Did you go in there, too? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir; there were several people there, newsmen and also, several officers stationed in that area out there. Mr. HUBERT. Now, were the television lights on all the time you were standing there? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir. Mr. HUBERT. Did they bother you? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir; they did. Mr. HUBERT. In what way? Mr. COMBEST. Well, when we first came downstairs it was a little hard to distinguish faces in this area here [indicating]. Mr. HUBERT. "Area B," the witness is pointing to "area B." Mr. COMBEST. And until you got used to them it was pretty hard to look into them. Mr. HUBERT. Did you get used to them? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir; I was pretty well used to them at the time the actual transfer took place. Mr. HUBERT. So, you could distinguish faces of people in "area B"? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir. Mr. HUBERT. Could you distinguish faces in "area A"? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir. Mr. HUBERT. The lights gave you no trouble by the time the transfer actually took place, is that correct? Mr. COMBEST. Yes, sir; that's correct. Mr. HUBERT. All right. When did you first see Ruby in that crowd? Mr. COMBEST. Just as they started to lead Oswald past me, at the corner there I observed him lunge from the crowd. Almost the whole line of people pushed forward when Oswald started to leave the jail office, the door, the hall--all the newsmen were poking their sound mikes across to him and asking questions, and they were everyone sticking their flashbulbs up and around and over him and in his face. I don't--when he first lunged forward I don't think anyone noticed him. I didn't until he came apart from the crowd and continued on towards Oswald. Mr. HUBERT. Now, did he come from the area--we have marked on this Exhibit 5100 as "area A" or as "area B," sir? Mr. COMBEST. The best I could tell he would be coming approximately half way between them there, between what you have marked as "area A," and "area B."