Mr. GRIFFIN. Are you not sure that he had jobs with both companies? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. The Spartan Co. there was such a company and Jack and Harry Epstein was his partner at that time and they sold novelties and premiums. By the way, Harry Epstein was a business associate of Jack’s for a good many years and knows him well. If there is anything that you might want to find out about his impetuousness or his decisive manner, because Harry and Jack always fought verbally, so Harry can give you a pretty good reason or reasons of his personality in that respect. I don’t know where you can find Harry. He could be in Chicago, he could be anywhere. Mr. GRIFFIN. The family has lost track of him? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Well, look; when the partnership breaks up--normally the partner comes over to the house and you meet him and see him and you have lunch with him. But when it breaks up you lose all contact with those people because he wasn’t my contact, he was Jack’s contact. And Jack being in Dallas all these years we didn’t even see Harry. Mr. GRIFFIN. Was Harry, would you say Harry, was one of the people who knew him best when he lived in Chicago? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. One of the best. Mr. GRIFFIN. Who would you say, who else would you say, knew Jack best when Jack lived in Chicago? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Benny Kay. Mr. GRIFFIN. What was his connection with Benny Kay. Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Very dear friends. Mr. GRIFFIN. Any business associates? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. I don’t know as any business associates but Benny Kay is a well respected businessman in Chicago. Mr. GRIFFIN. I am not asking for important people who knew him. Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Let’s say they bummed around together quite a bit. Mr. GRIFFIN. But if we were to go out and look for people who knew Jack better than anybody else, outside of the family, who were the people that you would name? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Put his name down, Benny Kay. Mr. GRIFFIN. Who else would you name? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Harry Epstein. Mr. GRIFFIN. Who else? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Hershey Colvin, and this Marty Gimpel that died, Marty could have given you a better report than anybody. Because Marty lived with him down in Dallas. Mr. GRIFFIN. I am talking about Chicago. Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Marty knew him from Chicago. Marty worked at the post office in Chicago. Mr. GRIFFIN. How about Alex Gruber? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Don’t know him. Never heard his name. Isn’t that odd? Of all the names that are in Chicago I never heard of him. Mr. GRIFFIN. How about Sam Gordon? Mr. RUBENSTEIN. Sam Gordon was a business associate of Jack, but not as good as these others. Sam was in the highlight of the depression and then moved to L.A. Mr. GRIFFIN. So your idea was Benny Kay, Hershey Colvin and Harry Epstein outside of Marty Gimpel who is now deceased?