The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which Framed the Constitution of the United States, May-September 1787. Volume 2Madison, James
History
The Journal of the Debates in the Convention which Framed the Constitution of the United States, May-September 1787. Volume 2
Madison, James
Constitutional law -- United States; Constitutions -- United States; United States. Constitution
M^r Sherman, resistance ag^{st} the laws of the U. States as
distinguished from resistance ag^{st} the laws of a particular State,
forms the line.
M^r Elseworth, the U. S. are sovereign on one side of the line dividing
the jurisdictions--the States on the other--each ought to have power to
defend their respective Sovereignties.
M^r Dickenson, war or insurrection ag^{st} a member of the Union must be
so ag^{st} the whole body; but the constitution should be made clear on
this point.
The clause was reconsidered nem. con--& then M^r Wilson & M^r Elseworth
moved to reinstate "ag^{st} the U. S." after "Treason--" on which
question
N. H. no. Mass. no. C^t ay. N. J. ay. P^a no. Del. no. M^d ay.
V^a ay. N. C. ay. S. C. no. Geo. ay.
M^r Madison was not satisfied with the footing on which the clause now
stood. As Treason ag^{st} the U. States involves treason ag^{st}
particular States, and vice versa, the same act may be twice tried &
punished by the different authorities. M^r Gov^r Morris viewed the
matter in the same light--
It was moved & 2^{ded} to amend the sentence to read--"Treason ag^{st}
the U. S. shall consist only in levying war against them, or in adhering
to their enemies" which was agreed to.
Col. Mason moved to insert the words "giving them aid and comfort," as
restrictive of "adhering to their Enemies &c." the latter he thought
would be otherwise too indefinite--This motion was agreed to: Con^t:
Del: & Georgia only being in the Negative.
M^r L. Martin moved to insert after conviction &c.--"or on confession in
open court"--and on the question (the negative States thinking the words
superfluous) it was agreed to
N. H. ay. Mass. no. C^t ay. N. J. ay. P. ay. Del. ay. M^d ay.
V^a ay. N. C. div^d. S. C. no. Geo. no.
Art: VII. Sect. 2, as amended was then agreed to nem. con.
Sect. 3. taken up. "white & other" struck out nem. con. as superfluous.
M^r Elseworth moved to require the first census to be taken within
"three" instead of "six" years from the first meeting of the
Legislature--and on question
N. H. ay. Mass. ay. C^t ay. N. J. ay. P^a ay. Del. ay. M^d ay.
V^a ay. N. C. ay. S. C. no. Geo. no.
M^r King asked what was the precise meaning of _direct_ taxation? No one
answ^d.
M^r Gerry moved to add to the 3^d Sect. Art: VII. the following clause
"That from the first meeting of the Legislature of the U. S. until a
Census shall be taken all monies for supplying the public Treasury by
direct taxation shall be raised from the several States according to the
number of their Representatives respectively in the first branch".
M^r Langdon. This would bear unreasonably hard on N. H. and he must be
ag^{st} it.
M^r Carrol opposed it. The number of Rep^s did not admit of a proportion
exact enough for a rule of taxation.
Before any question the House
Adjourned.
TUESDAY AUGUST 21. IN CONVENTION
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