"Then his pipe was lighted?"--"Yes. He came over to me and lit his pipe from the match that lit my pipe, holding his head up close to mine." "After you came out of the alley what did you see?"--"The police were there; then the explosion followed." "Did you see Spies go into the alley?"--"I did not." "Did you see anybody in the alley?"--"Yes. There were two or three men there, but I could not tell who they were. It was dark." "Did anybody come into the alley while you were there?"--"No." "Could anybody pass into the alley without your knowing it?"--"No, sir; I stood up close to the building while I was lighting my pipe." "Now, tell whether you saw a light in the air about that time or a little after."--"Yes; I saw a light like a match about twenty feet south of the alley on Desplaines street." Mr. Grinnell takes the witness in hand. "You say you came down town on business. Who did you want to see?"--"A friend of mine." "Who is he?"--"Adolph Winness." "Where does he live?"--"I do not know." "Where does he work?"--"I don't know now." "What does he work at?"--"He is a woodworker." "How did you expect to meet him then, if you did not know where he lived or where he worked?"--"He told me I could find him there." "Find him where?"--"On Randolph street." "When did you see him last?"--"That afternoon. He came out to see me." "And he did not tell you where he worked?"--"No." "Nor where he stopped?"--"No." "Yet he said you could find him on Randolph street?"--"Yes." "So he gave you the idea that he could be found out of doors, did he?"--"Well, he's around Randolph street a good deal." "Where did you meet Albright?"--"In the alley." "Near Crane Brothers?"--"Yes." "What did you say?"--"I said: 'Hello, Albright,' and he said: 'Hello, Krumm.'" "What else?"--"Did you say you came down town to see a friend?"--"Yes." "Did you tell him the name of your friend?"--"No." "Who was speaking then?"--"Parsons, I think." "Tell what he said."--"He said something about Jay Gould." "What did Spies say?"--"He said: 'A few words more, boys, and we'll go home.'" "Spies said that, did he?"--"Yes." "Which man is Spies?"--The witness confounds the men. Asked to indicate Spies he points to Fielden. "How did you stand in the alley when the speaking was going on?"--"I had my back to the north wall." "Did you stand that way all the time?"--"Yes, except when we lit our pipes." "Then did you stand the same way after you lighted your pipes?"--"Yes." "Then how could you see these men if you had your backs to the wall?"--"I looked over my head." "You looked over your head all the time?"--"Yes, when we looked at the speakers." "And you never saw these men before?"--"No." "Yet from that point in the alley, the speakers eight feet or more distant, a crowd between you, you looking over your shoulders in the dark, you recognize these men the first time you saw them?"--"Yes."