Mr. WULF. Well, he impressed me as a boy who could get violent over communism, who, if you did not agree with his belief, he would argue with you violently over it. This, as you know, was the period right before he moved, I believe, to Dallas. I did hear that he had moved to Dallas. I got that from McBride. And he struck me as a very boisterous boy and very determined in his way about communism. Mr. LIEBELER. Did he strike you as boisterous in any other respect, or strongheaded about other things? Mr. WULF. Generally a strongheaded boy that knew his own mind, thought he knew his own mind, and would do his own will. He wanted his way, in other words. Mr. LIEBELER. Then there never was any question of physical---- Mr. WULF. No. Mr. LIEBELER. Contact over this thing? Mr. WULF. No, no. Mr. LIEBELER. It was just a strongly presented argument? Mr. WULF. No. My father just took him by the arm, and when he started hollering about communism and all, and my father had gone through Communist affairs in Germany in the 1920's, and did not agree with him violently, and he asked him to leave the house. Mr. LIEBELER. Is your father a native of Germany? Mr. WULF. Hamburg. Mr. LIEBELER. And he had been involved in some political activities with or opposed to the Communists? Mr. WULF. Not that I know of. What I mean, he came back from Germany following the war, 1919-20, when it was all upheaval. The Democratic Party was fighting the Communist wing and all. He remembered that and he just--well, as most Germans, a lot of Germans, do, they just don't like Communists. Mr. LIEBELER. Can you remember anything about the details of your first meeting with Lee Oswald? Mr. WULF. Very little. If I remember correctly, the main thing was that he asked--we talked about astronomy, and I drew from that, from the conversation, that he knew very little about astronomy, and it struck me that he wanted to join the group, because I expressed to him at the time that anyone with a little knowledge of astronomy was hampered in the group and mostly everybody in the group knew astronomy and we were not very much interested in teaching some fledgling all this data we had already gone through over the years, and he would actually be hampered in belonging to the group, and I actually discouraged him from joining the group for that reason. That is all I can remember of the first contact, because it was kind of late, it was probably 2 or 3 o'clock in the morning. Mr. LIEBELER. This was at a meeting of the association? Mr. WULF. No; this was at my home. McBride had brought him to my house. It must have been 10 o'clock at night or 11 o'clock at night, something like that, and we got into a conversation on astronomy in general and just a general topical conversation as far as I can remember. It is somewhat hard to remember, you know, after all these years. Mr. LIEBELER. There wasn't any discussion of politics or economics at that time? Mr. WULF. Not at that time; no.