‘It seems certain that we shall have to change much,’ said Lysis. ‘Yes,’ I answered, ‘for at present they educate the men and the women together though they are going to do different work afterwards and so should receive a different training.’ ‘Yes,’ they said, ‘we must alter that, and not educate any more of the men.’ ‘That will go far to solve one of our problems, for at present the chances of education are destroyed by the numbers of the students, and the Americans think it finer to give a smattering of information to everybody than to give education to a few, and talk with pride of the preposterous numbers that pass through their colleges.’ ‘If there are so many students, Socrates,’ asked Phaelon, ‘is there not a great body of teachers? What part do they play in America and could not they be the guardians?’ ‘Why,’ I said, ‘of all who suffer from the present ill-ordered life there, none suffer more than do these teachers. But if you will be patient with me I will describe how they live.’ ‘Proceed, Socrates.’ ‘To begin with, does it not seem to you that those who separate themselves so sharply from the popular outlook and embrace the pursuit of learning rather than that of wealth will be no ordinary Americans, but will either be above or below their fellow citizens.’ ‘It would seem so, indeed,’ they answered. ‘The best,’ I said, ‘are much above their fellows and seek this life from a noble love of noble things. Do you know what happens to a great number of such men in America?’ ‘What?’ they asked with apprehension. ‘You do well to look frightened,’ I said gravely. ‘They are made Presidents of universities and colleges, and after that there is no peace for them at all. But they are compelled to spend all their time like the generals of disorderly and worthless troops, organizing the great numbers of their students and providing useless courses for countless blockheads. Moreover, they are driven to associate with the men of commerce and to flatter them for their great wealth.’ ‘Why in the world should they have to do that?’ Lysis demanded. ‘To make the college bigger,’ I replied. ‘For the Americans estimate a President by his power to obtain benefactions and so to build new wings and offices, and leave a larger institution than he found. They are soon to build in America the tallest university in the world. And there is a worse consequence even than this waste of fine men in presidential duties.’ ‘What can be worse than that?’ ‘Why,’ I said, ‘with all the colleges competing for the gifts of rich men will not those colleges obtain most whose teachers teach what the rich men like to have believed?’ ‘Naturally.’ ‘And where a college has much to hope from wealthy persons will it not hesitate to lose large sums of money rather than discourage free inquiry into everything?’ ‘I think it will do more than hesitate, it will sacrifice the inquiries for the gold.’