Mr. SERVEN. I doubt it, unless he had attempted to form a company for the purpose of performing it. Mr. CHANEY. Of course you would have to get the singers together. Mr. SERVEN. You would have to do more than that; you would have to do the same thing that is done with a dramatic composition, and the remedy is the same in this case for a musical drama that it is for a tragedy or any other drama; the condition is the same, the remedy is the same, and if it is a wrong to the dramatist in one case it is a wrong to the music publisher in the other. Mr. CHANEY. You take a church organization that seeks to raise money, for instance, to buy a pipe organ; they send to Mr. Tams or somebody who has these books, and they tell him how many they would like to get, and ask him how much he will charge for them, and it may be that sometimes they could get them for just the expense of the express charges and the payment for any damage or for any books destroyed. They go ahead and produce that musical operetta. Now, they have committed a crime? Mr. SERVEN. No; because before that they have to have somebody who is a musical director, who knows about it. Mr. CHANEY. That goes with the performance---- Mr. SERVEN. There is not such a person as that in the United States, I assume, that does not know just exactly what the provisions of law are. Mr. BONYNGE. But he is not the only person who would be guilty of the crime. Those in the chorus would be guilty of the crime. Mr. SERVEN. But here is the point---- Mr. CHANEY. The person who proposes to organize such an oratorio usually proposes it to the church. Mr. SERVEN. As a matter of fact, I have been informed that Mr. Tams is the principal gentleman in the United States who is doing that sort of thing, to persuade people to violate this statute. Why? Because it is to his profit. At least we assume it is, because, according to his ratings, and so forth, we understand he has made a large amount of money in this particular business. In fact, it has been suggested that Mr. Tams's financial standing compares very favorably with some of these musical composers we have heard about. The CHAIRMAN. I want to put into the record at this point this notice. Mr. TINDALE. May I correct a typographical error? The CHAIRMAN. No; read it just as it is. Mr. TINDALE. (reading from the first page of a musical composition): The copying of either the separate parts or the entire composition by any process whatsoever is forbidden and subject to the penalties provided under section 4965 of the copyright laws, right to performance can only be secured by the purchase of a copy of this score for each and every singer taking part. You do not allow any comments? The CHAIRMAN. We will ask for comments. How lately have you been putting that notice in your copyright books? Mr. TINDALE. For about four years. The CHAIRMAN. Does that give any notice to the purchaser of this book that he can not rent or loan it?